More 2 Marketing

Susan
More to marketing. Welcome to more to marketing, the podcast that explores marketing, product and everything in between. I’m your host, Susan, and today we’re gonna be talking about branding. I would love to introduce a very special guest, Kim, and his award-winning marketing veteran, who has Co founded her own agency. Kim has provided brand guidance with the focus on brand building and activations and she is a huge supporter of women entrepreneurs into business. She’s done magical things with huge brands over in America, and I’d love to introduce you to Kim and let her talk a bit about herself. Welcome, Kim.
Kim
Hi, thanks for that wonderful introduction. Yes, I have an marketing agency called Enthuse Marketing which we started in 2016. And one year later, we also started a nonprofit that invests in women entrepreneurs really taking. Businesses from what we call new to next, so whether that be the brilliance of an idea, taking it to the next level or those that have a certain amount of revenue taking their business to the next level. So the marketing agency actually supports the vision of the nonprofit and we have over 5000. Community members. So we’re very work. We’ve done helping to spark that community of women on. Ignores.
Susan
I absolutely love that giving back aspect, particularly with all your experience to be able to help just in feedback or other smaller ways as well that must be just such golden little Nuggets for them to continue their journey.
Kim
Absolutely. And and knowing that we were a marketing agency, we could have that voice within our own community of other agencies, but also with our clients showcasing that women owned businesses could really be. Force and a driving force and and really bringing attention to the small amount of investment that goes into women owned businesses less than 2% and it’s it says 3 but it’s really around 2.5% of VC funding goes into women owned businesses but over 40% of them are. So that means they’re bootstrapping. They’re crowded. Funding. They’re getting friends and family money or they’re doing. A side hustle. So our agency is really dedicated to putting forth that voice to say, hey, this isn’t right. And what can we do about it and really showing that with our. Clients as well.
Susan
And I love that you’ve got the demonstrated experience and you’re seeing all these women flourish. That must just give you so much joy every day when you see those new little snippets that might come in your. Email going guess what?
Kim
Absolutely. One of our our winners from one of our pitch competitions recently got bought from a larger business. So she sold me and now she’s giving back and it was the most fulfilling phone call I’ve had since the foundation started. She said. I really want to talk to you. Can I get on your calendar? I’m like, absolutely. I want to hear all about your story from the sale. And we got on the phone and her message was you did so much for me. I want to give back to the community. And I was like, Oh my gosh, this is what her vision was when we started and. And so it was. It brought so much joy for someone to come in. Full circle go through that process of a sale acquisition and understand all of the you know, the journey that that takes and then sharing that with the community, but also wanting to give back to you know how how she got started. So it was very, very emotional.
Susan
I I I bet and. And that is just a a beautiful case day to be able to show others as well. Going through it that it will be tough. It’s not easy, but keep at it.
Kim
Yes, I mean, 100 knows some of the entrepreneurs have told us and it’s, you know, you hear that and you’re like, you’re still here, though you’re still putting your business forth and that’s. That’s the right attitude to have.
Susan
Exactly. And I think one of the the more important aspects for me that I’d love to talk to you about. So I know you’ve got so much experience in this is the purpose of brand when you’re building. So why is that so important during those? Images.
Kim
Really, the brand, what I I call is the centrepiece or the cornerstone of a company success. It really shapes everything from how business is perceived. To how a consumer’s loyalty to you and and really enables that sustainable growth, you’re always pointing back to your brand. And connecting with those customers. So every connection that you have is that your brand is in their face, right and we we say that about our own brand, right? Like why we do certain things like there would be fundraising, we could do a certain way. There would be businesses that we could help in other ways and it’s like really we want to be small. Mighty and we want to make sure that the businesses we give our donations to and our money to are really making a difference and an impact. And so it it helps with those guardrails too, because this is your brand that’s going out there. It’s like your child. Like naming your child. To like you. You you get to Foster and grow it, and understanding that it’s a constant. I think some people feel like, oh, I create a logo and I I put it out there and it’s just a brand and it’s like. No, it’s a constant fluid. You always have to be kind of shaping and Morphy. Doing it because you know that it is changing environments, right? People are changing. Consumers are changing. There’s a whole new wave of people coming in the landscape that we’re in the digital media like, there’s something’s changing all the time and you have to make sure that your brand is stable.
Susan
Exactly. And I think even if you look at some of the. With large big brands that have been around for quite a long time. Even Nike, with its tick the tick, has slightly changed overtime and the placement of it, even some of the colours have McDonald’s has slightly changed its overtime as well. So like you said you don’t you can’t just stay static, you do have to sometimes adapt a bit more for relevancy, but always keeping that customer at the core. And it is you. It’s representing you, so you. Want it to? Do the best job it can and bring the right people into that you’re trying to connect with.
Kim
Absolutely, absolutely. What? What steps would you recommend?
Susan
When a business is either starting a new brand or wants to maybe revitalise an existing one, how? Should they go about that?
Kim
It’s it. It’s building off of something you just said. It’s understanding your audience, understanding the consumer and and being out there. We one of the big things that we strive for is you have to get out in the market. You have to see how our we do a lot of activation. So we’re out doing programmes. But if you’re not seeing how a consumer is taking in the creative that you designed or the content that you put out there and you’re not, you’re seeing it for first hand. First of all, it’s magical to see it, and but you’re getting that real time feedback and understanding exactly how an audience is connecting with that. So that’s first of all. Market research, understanding the market trends too. We’re in the United States where in California it’s completely different than New York City in terms of what’s happening in the market, how people go to a a store or how they’re shopping in a retail environment and versus New York City where it’s very much smaller footprints versus a large retail. So understanding the market. Trends and and where you are. And then what’s your what? I would call your unique prospect, right. Like your unique selling proposition. What is so unique about your brand and and how is how does that make it different from its competition? And once you know those things, you can really start to as a #2 step clearly articulate. What the values and mission are? So if you know all of those things like, what’s my audience, what’s happening in the market that I want to go in or after go into and then what is different about my brand then that’s when the architecture of. Those brand values in that mission have to be so crystal clear. I think that’s the hardest thing for any brand to do. It’s hard for me just. Articulating something with, you know, less than 10 words and and you know understanding that that those 10 words have to be so sharp and crisp that they say exactly what you need to do. And it’s very hard because so many brands or people that are are working for brands want to put as much information as they can or or list everything out. And bullet points, it’s like, no, no, no, you have to like back it up. And I think that’s that’s really hard to do because. You think you’re. Missing out? Yeah, but the clearer you are. The more you’re actually gonna connect, and I think that’s a big aha for people like when when you see something that’s super crisp and clear, everybody gets it. The people that you want to get it.
Susan
Right, exactly. Exactly. And you might see a giant big sign that has like, 10 points on it and you just don’t know what they’re trying to tell you. And you don’t have time to absorb.
Susan
It because you’ve moved on.
Kim
Correct. Yes, yes. And then the design, the brand visuals is so critical of what is that? What is that? What do you, what does it look? Like the colours that you choose and and then once you have that brand kind of established it’s it’s how are you connecting them with those audience where where are you putting yourself, you know everyone thinks you have to be on TikTok well, is that where your audience is? Is that where your? Message. Is going to be is that and and and you really have to know that you can’t. Face the trends. It’s really where is your audience and where are you going to engage with them so that they get your brand for, for for what you’re trying to achieve? Monitor and adjust. I think this goes twofold to the very beginning of the market research, talk to people. And I was just working on a positioning statement and I I presented it to a current client, a past client and and agency owners and the feedback came in so many different ways. But it was so valuable to me because the perspective I was able to get.
Kim
So seeing how it’s doing and and performing but also engaging with those whether they’re brand fans or loyalists, talking to them and getting that feedback, because that feedback is so critical where you just might have. A blind spot.
Susan
Exactly. And sometimes people misinterpret very easily or even the colour could offend some cultures. There’s so many different aspects of that people may not understand. Yeah, yeah. One of the fun ones for me is some colours are actually trademarked.
Kim
Yes.
Susan
So for example, like the Cadbury purple, that’s a trademark colour. Some people might not realise they cannot use that colour in any of their material because. So. Actually owns the colour.
Kim
Is any any would when when would? You ever believe that?
Susan
Exactly. And you’d be like, are they really going to chase? Me that they will.
Susan
Even sometimes the names being so similar, there’s there’s one that’s in the news quite a lot in Australia, which is Katy Perry. There’s there’s Katy Perry, the artist, the celebrity, and then there’s Katy Perry. I believe it’s fashion. And different spellings, but going to court. Because of the name, because the celebrity doesn’t want it being used. But I believe the name was already up. The brand was already out there for quite a while. So and there’s no no connection, no similarity in the spelling either. But going to court just because of something like that, simple with a name.
Kim
Right. Right, right. Yes, that should be part of the steps, but.
Susan
Do a check.
Kim
Monitor, adjust and and legal compliance.
Susan
This was another big one in Australia as well. An American company owns the rights to the name, but it’s a traditional name he used for those sheepskin slippers.
Kim
Yes.
Susan
That that you wear. So they’re known as Uggs here. And that was another one that’s gone to court as well. Wow. Name being used.
Kim
Wow, that’s incredible.
Susan
A bit crazy but umm I have. Personal love for interactive activations. That’s one of my most favourite things. I love seeing different ways it’s been brought about. One of the ones I loved that was in Melbourne so I only saw pictures of it was when the Lord of the Rings new TV series was coming out to support that they actually. Took over bus shelters and made them into all the different scenes. So one of them might be inside a palace, the other one was outside in a forest, so they actually put like leaves on the top and they changed out the benches to be like a log or wherever it might be or Thrones.
Kim
Yes.
Susan
I thought that was absolutely amazing and I love seeing those kind of. Things that you can actually touch, feel, and have a sensory experience around, and I know you’re huge at this and I believe that it’s actually the art of visual merchandising is underestimated and underrated. So what are? Your views on activations and how can they be incorporated?
Kim
I’m so excited about this question. First of all, you I’m like, I didn’t mean to be rude and but.
You. I know. I know. You’re like, I wanna answer I.
Off.
Susan
Want to answer? I love it.
Kim
It’s yes, it’s the core of what we do and what is so. Essential, I think is is exactly where you were going is all it’s visual storytelling. And I think we often overlook that when we’re walking in a store like there’s an opportunity to make a make an emotional connection with someone just by what you were saying, like the doorway, how is the door perceived and being in the hospitality environment, I think the hospitality world is excellent at that. If you think about. The Ritz Carlton experience or any of the luxury hotel properties they’re thinking about you as their guest well before you’ve entered the door, right? Like they see who you are when you’re when you’re made your reservation and they know things about and. And they just make every detail special. And I think that’s how we think about activations is how every single person’s going to perceive every, every part of it from the moment they step out. We we do a lot here. From an activation perspective in Grand Central station.
Susan
Wow, that would be amazing.
Kim
Grand Central is a busy transit hub, right? Like work. They don’t want to stop. They don’t. They don’t want to engage unless something captures their attention. So for us, it’s all about knowing how to your you’ve got seconds of their time and how do you make them stop. But then immediately there’s a. There’s a form of whether it’s personalization. Or something feels like right for them. We do a lot of work with the spirits industry, so the beverage alcohol space, so if you can connect with someone as they’re walking and it’s coming up on Father’s Day and we can custom print your dad’s name on a Johnny Walker bottle and like you, you have to understand the. Environment that you’re in, but then to connect it to be something personal where they feel like ohh, you know exactly who my dad is or I want it for me or I want it for. My wife like like.
Susan
I’ll take two.
Kim
Yeah, exactly. It makes people feel understood like you’re like, ohh. Or this is a moment where we do a lot for sparkling water and and still water and like, so it’s like I’m thirsty and you just handed me water at that moment of need. The moment of need. So like, that’s how our creative team really looks at. Division is like. What’s the story we’re trying to tell? How much time do we have? So those different environments, right. Like you could be at a. You’re sponsoring a concert, and you might be in a space as people are walking in or a football game or a sporting event. And so you have to understand like they’re walking to get to the game. You have that limited. Time frame. So and what’s their mindset? Are they happy? Are they excited at the end we we call it exit sampling. Their team may have lost. So you have to be prepared for that. So what is? That what is that one thing you want them to take away and then build everything around that.
Kim
And then people feel this brand gets me. There’s a connection that really makes them remember it. And and that’s I think sometimes when we think of activations, it’s putting just what we were talking about branding, putting too much in there, that people get confused or over stimulated. They don’t remember it, they don’t remember. What brand it was, they don’t remember. We need to. They might remember parts of it, but they don’t get the core message. So when I say storytelling, it’s like, what’s the start, the middle and the end that we want someone to do and how much time do we have to get it? And then retro it into that environment.
Susan
No, I think I haven’t seen any of live central station ones, but I can imagine that they’re quite. Big it wouldn’t just be like the ones I’ve seen in Sydney. So in our train stations there’ll be just like a little booth and two people standing there, or maybe even at a big esky kind of thing that looks like a can of whatever the drink is, and they just stand handing it.
Kim
Yeah. Out and it’s just mass sampling.
Susan
That yeah, that, that’s. What we normally see when we’re in the Sydney. Train station. And how does it actually look for you, though, when you’re at central? Can you just, can you try and describe it a little?
Kim
Bit. Yeah. So the the wonderful thing about Grand Central station is there is a large footprint. So you can have activations that are very scalable, meaning you could have that small footprint like you talked about with just a. Kind of a what I’ll call pop up display.
Susan
Exactly.
Kim
Where you can. Sampling, but you can have a large experience. This wasn’t one of our activation. But. It was a tourist company and it was all promoting Beverly Hills, CA, so Beverly Hills, CA in in New York City and they created an entire cityscape. So it looked like you were walking the streets of Beverly Hills and and almost creating all of the things you could do if you travelled there. And the whole idea was. Hey, think about this on your next vacation or your next trip and and. It there was. Like booking agents there to book it for you, it was all just that memory of like ohh there’s the sign. The Hollywood sign. I can see where you know the Beverly Hilton Hotel. Like all of these vignettes and and the the shopping areas and and everyone felt like they wanted to go there even though. All of those things were probably in their backyard. In New York. City it was just. This like kind of Oasis. And so as you’re walking to the train now, you went and you’re just like, that was really fun.
Susan
I love the fun aspect of that as. Well, but for the business itself, maybe even that as an example, how do you actually measure the impact of activations for the brand? And also it’s worth because there would be a type of return on investment you’d hope to receive.
Kim
Which is the. All but everybody is looking at now, especially in in the squeeze economy of every dollar. Has to be measured. There’s there’s a quite a few ways, and we have we have proprietary ways that we measure. And when I say proprietary, we take all of the things that are happening within the space, whether that be the pre promotion on digital and social, who’s engaging with it, really traffic, foot traffic. So and and the the day of. And then if there’s any financial measures that we have, if if it’s a brand that’s sampling as you said that you can see, were there any sales that spikes in sales? We usually do a look of the whole month. So look how, yeah, how did that work? We look at social media shares, if there’s any kind of photo.
Susan
Get the long down effect.
Kim
Engagement. And then we actually do consumer surveys right on site. So this is a great one to understand like, have you ever heard of this brand? Before, did you ever buy it? Have you bought it in the last three months and just asking very simple questions that you can get very fast. You can then say, oh, we reached new consumers or, oh, we reached people that already love this brand and our brand loyalist. So now there’s a way to to to you know. Reward them for that loyalty. So if you could get some data capture a lot of photo engagements are so easy to get data capture, whether that’s a scan, QR code or a a picture, they can, you know, then return their email and you can say thanks for coming. Here’s an offer. So really, that engagement, so how I would all of those things combined, I just think that there’s two things. There’s the qualitative what’s happening from the quality of like are you delivering on that brand experience. So what is is that worth to a brand? And then there’s the quantitative and they think you have to have a balance of both. Because it in an activation world, you’re doing both in terms of brand building as well as driving the commercial kind of aspect as well with sales.
Susan
Exactly. And I’ve actually been one of the people in the queue for for one similar to this when friends was being brought around back into the country. Is one of one of the big streaming services. I believe it was Stan at the time was picking it up and they put in an actual coffee shop in the middle of one of the parks in Sydney and you could line up. You didn’t get anything you could line up and just get your photo in the room. And there were a few people. There, that would hold your phone up. Get it? And you had a couple of little props you could Chuck on yourself like a hat or a scarf or a mug. And you just sit on this couch and the whole point was one to let people know friends was coming back onto TV was. And the social engagement of it. So I’m sure part of their metrics was going to be how many of these people actually then shared on to all the different socials and then how many people saw it from that?
Kim
Yeah. And there’s there’s such. Good quality metrics now with social media. Like if I post something and and it watches my engagement, there’s measures of like what that value is in the media perspective. Based on that engagement. So it’s not just about me posting it, it’s about. Did someone comment, did someone like what is that engagement and how you know how long did that content? Live. On and and there’s, like I said, there’s so many sophistication and the types of measurement. So that really does help.
Susan
Yes, I think one of the ones that does freak me out a little bit is when there’s the eyeball technology in that, that one there does freak me out a little bit, particularly if you ever see behind the scenes on how it actually works.
Kim
Yeah, you know, it’s it’s funny going back to the brand. Like I even the whole artificial intelligence and like writing and writing creative. And I just like we are. So what I would say against it and I see artificial intelligence. Used in helping with efficiency in what I would call mundane tasks right, like great expense reports. For example my timesheet.
That’s a good one.
Kim
Alright. Yeah, right. Things that I have to do just to be in business, right? But I don’t personally have to do them right.
Kim
But when you’re talking about the the thought leadership and the knowledge base that you need to really connect like, what’s the tension of this brand, what are they trying to do and how are we bringing that to life for a consumer? You can’t put that into an AI and say figure this out for me. And now I’m going to like, I don’t think that’s fair to a client. That’s paying us, but also I I don’t. I think that takes away our unique proposition as an agency and a creative services company. We have to own something and I think that it it could start to commoditize the creativity in the world and that scares me.
Susan
Yeah. I think part of that’s also a machine doesn’t have emotions or empathy to be able to understand what you’re trying to create and make people feel.
Kim
Yes, yes, absolutely. And that’s what all experiential marketing is about is, is that emotional connection. So I think there’s way there’s, I’m definitely not the type that’s like, no, never, it’s more like. How do you? Right. How do you use it in the best place in your business that makes your business better?
Susan
Exactly one of the ones that I found really handy when using the likes of the the chat GPTS of the world is having it connected to the web version. So then I can get, say, a different view of competitors. So I might be searching and looking for competitors and going out with what I believe. It should be. From my perception and then I have other team members put their their thoughts in as well, and then I’ll run it in there just to see if there’s any ones I haven’t heard of that are up and coming. And it’s been very handy for me for doing that type of research because it’s better than I find the Google and the bings of the world because it plugs into all of.
Kim
Sure.
Susan
Them.
Kim
That’s a that’s a really good use for it and and that’s where I get excited about of like where. Can you use? It that actually really helps you move things forward or get to a solution faster or to your point of competitive Intel research and and and finding things. Things that you would be Googling anyways.
Susan
Exactly. And just. And then you it has all the links so you can go. If not you look. At all the pages as well yourself.
Kim
Wonderful.
Susan
So I find I find that very helpful and again I put very strict logic into it to say just give me 10 or 20 so it just does and I might even put in there have.
Kim
It keeps scrolling.
Susan
To have a. Revenue, I know. I might even put things in there and must have a a a net revenue of X amount as well. So then it actually does. Sizing of it all for me too, which I’m finding Google isn’t able to do as well, so that that’s just my example of how I’ve been able. To use it to help. That’s great. So I would love to hear some examples from yourself, if you. Can pick one. On how you’ve actually developed a brand strategy, you don’t have to tell about the brand, but just some of the steps that you’ve gone through.
Kim
Yeah. So I I can go a little bit deep and I can share the brand. I think I think I’m. Fine. Because out there we work on a whiskey brand and the brand is Crown Royal and Crown Royal is ubiquitous here in the United States like it’s almost in every bar in America. From a distribution?
Susan
Well known.
Kim
Perspective, yeah. Yes, and they have a campaign or their their positioning is really live generously and they’re they do a lot for consumers. So consumers can be part of what they call generosity events where they’re giving back to their communities, giving back to and and crown royales kind of the. Owner of these events? Well, one of the things that we recognised was. Everybody that was a consumer of Crown Royal and knew that the brand was living generously because they would take part in these events. There was a lot of, there was a lot. To do with. Big events that would happen so you could attend an event or you could personally donate and you would see where your your dollars went by by. Ordering a crown Crown Royal cocktail. So that was very well known and very well understood. What wasn’t understood as much or or it was wasn’t generous in the same way, is probably a better way to say it was with the bartending community, the people that actually poured the drink and served the drink. Because they it it wasn’t. Ubiquitous like it was to the consumer, right? They they understood it very well and connected with it. So we thought there was an opportunity to what I’ll say, reset that live generously tagline or or proposition, I’ll call it back with the trade community because. The audience is so different. Bartenders work in and operate in a complete different world, even though they are consumers too, they’re taking the they’re they’re crafting their drinks and they’re creating. So what we did was we we just created an entire strategy that would resonate with these bartenders. Crafting the narrative that was focused on them and lived generously was about how they engaged with the brand. So generous to a bartender was providing things like education, education, and how to get insurance because they don’t have it from their employer. Education on how to be a better bartender if they were just beginning their skills, education, and craft. So we were generously changing the narrative about how. Crown Royal could help them in their in in their work. And and it was so fun. And and the steps were really, I think when we were talking about that market research, we didn’t see it either until we started seeing all the things that they were doing. And we started putting in them buckets like they’re doing it. Consumers understand it. People understand it. You know, who doesn’t understand it? This whole community over here.
Susan
The one serving it up, yeah.
Kim
Being this audience and to your point, they’re the ones that are the critical gatekeeper of of getting it to the consumer. So we gotta be generous to them. And then what is generous look like and. I think sometimes segmenting the audience was the the biggest aha for us, right, like that consumer that’s poor or the the the person pouring it is just as important as the person consuming it. But the messaging and the way you go about engaging with them is completely different. So extremely fun project to work on. But it it really opened our eyes too. When you’re designing that brand strategy, you can’t just think of everybody as the same and and really honing in on what it looks like. But I think the most important part is keeping it consistent. You didn’t go off. And create a whole new thing. For bartenders, we used that framework of what lived generously meant and how did it was the trait. How did it impact the trade, and how did it connect with the trade. So really ensuring that we didn’t veer from what the true brand strategy was, it was just how did it connect with that? Audience and that was a really fun example that I I always like to talk.
Susan
About that’s a great. Cause that it just also shows that if people are off doing customer journey maps they are missing a key element. So that’s where service diagrams or other kinds of mapping tools are needed. Just so you can actually see all the different touch points and how they interact and then maybe do different journey. Mappings on those depending on those individuals and what they do.
Kim
Yeah, absolutely. And to your point, it’s. We often look at consumer journeys of just how does how does one buy and not who all touches it. In all of those different ways. So it’s it’s it’s very important.
Susan
I love that one and for brand building should be at the heart of any new service or product. What is a key mistake that you have? Being done over and over again when it comes to branding.
Kim
Well, there’s two things that come to mind. I think the 1st is not prioritising the customer, not putting the customer at the core. Often we get so precious about the brand. We’ve built the brand that we’ve you know we’re working on. If you’re a brand manager and and you’re you’re, you get so. Enamoured by what you want it to be. And not what the customer actually wants, so having that. That realisation of of I’ve worked with so many brands and like well, this is how we want to be perceived and it’s like 100% that’s always great of like here’s your aspiration, but this is actually how consumers are using your product. So you have to have that at in mind every time you’re doing any kind of brand building. Campaign like you need to know who’s using your product, who are those loyal consumers? And and I think that always has to be in the middle and the centre point of when you’re building your brand because that’s that’s who you need. You need to, you need to connect with. The other thing is the inconsistency. It drives me crazy.
Susan
Yes.
Kim
We what we were saying like it’s chasing. Friend or like wanting to do something for a PR stunt or like create and then and then forgetting that their brand is what people will remember and then they have a different message or a different message because they think they have to change it up all the. Time and so change for change sake is like OK, what is true about this brand that will never veer and you have to stay consistent. And we are chatting at the beginning of this with like so many things like you can showcase like uh drives me crazy.
Susan
I I agree, and it does drive me nuts when I see something very random. Going on out there and I just, I just stop and I’m like, why? Yeah. And it’s not a good why. It’s a bad why? Because you just like that. Doesn’t make sense. Like for. For me, one of my my pet peeves is random train takeovers on the outside that make no sense whatsoever. And it’s just to get a brand name out there because trains happen to go through train stations. People stand and wait for. Fine, but it just doesn’t make sense.
The Billboard, yeah.
Kim
Right.
Susan
Right, because you don’t have time to read it half the time, it might have graffiti on it, whatever it might be, it’s just like. Probably a waste of a lot of money.
Kim
Yes, absolutely, absolutely. But those are those are the big ones for me. Consistency and customer at the.
Susan
Gore. Yeah, that makes complete sense. I know you have worked on many, many brands and building many brands as well. But what excites you the most about doing this?
Kim
Wow, that’s.
Susan
A loaded question.
Kim
It’s a funny question too. I think it’s the the, I’ll say, melting pot of so many diverse disciplines, if that makes sense. So the discipline of, like human psychology. With creative mixed with you know analytics like you’re you’re constantly. So you’re looking at data. Yeah, you’re looking at how do people interact and then you’re saying, how do I mix it up and then creative. So it’s like I feel. Like a chef. You’re creating something, so I think those things together just can make magic happen. And so for me, that’s so fun. And it’s so fun to start with. Like, what’s the? Problem and the creative solution is and is not and we say this so often, everyone’s like, oh, we have to go to the creative team. It’s like the creative solution can be found anywhere. It’s really what’s the problem we’re trying to solve and how the creative solution gets. I’ll I’ll say to life the recipe delivered. It doesn’t always have to come from a creative team or a creative member. It can be the strategy team. It can be the account team that like understands the client. But I think that’s been a big push we’ve had within the walls of our own agency is just understanding that it’s not just a thing you have to make, it’s. How are we answering the problem? And and it’s opened our eyes to even just how we have conversations with clients. It’s. Like. Getting to the problem or getting to the solution is 3 steps. It could be hiring someone in a role that you don’t have for connect to your sales and marketing better and through this this work, but it’s not necessarily a website or a design of something or an activation. And and that’s been. Fun to do too, because you’re still doing those kind of what I said diverse, divergent thinking coming together. But it’s it’s like ohh this is the solution and it doesn’t have to be an output of something.
Susan
I love it. It’s all the discovery pieces to get to the end.
Kim
I love that yes, fun and and it keeps you like I I think there’s always a challenge, right? Every brand challenge every day it’s like. Just stopping there. What’s your challenge? And then just kind of walking through that and and you know we are so fortunate to work with so many wonderful brands that come to us like. And have realised that we we just are problem solvers. We’re not necessarily, you know, I hate the word saying we’re this kind of agency or that kind of agency. It’s like we just solve problems. So we’ll give us the problem and you know we may not be able to come up with the solution but if we know what the problem is we’re so much more creative.
Susan
Exactly. And I think too many people jumped to solution mode because one they might want to see themselves on that bus or that train, for example. They don’t actually exactly. They don’t actually think about the process to get there and the steps needed.
Kim
Or win an award. Yeah. 100% yes.
Susan
OK well I have to say thank you so much. I’m going to give you my final question, which is my question I. Ask every guest.
Kim
Oh.
Susan
This one, this one maybe here. I don’t know you. You might go. Multi personality. I mean have like 5. What brand any brand in the world this represents you and why?
Kim
Ohh my gosh. So wow that that you know, 100 come to mind as you said. So I have to.
Susan
Yeah.
Kim
To think, but if right when you said it, I probably should have. Shouldn’t have been thinking right away and trying to like manage, but. I think of a brand when I when I think of me personally, is something that’s timeless. And when you say the name, it brings you joy. So I think I would choose Disney. Because it encapsulates the sense of wonder and endless possibilities.
Passive.
Susan
And it’s fun.
Kim
It’s fun and and it’s just I think there’s something really special about finding magic and ordinary everyday moments, and I think they’ve done a wonderful job of that. And if you said that. Name to everyone you just like feel people will feel that magic, and so my personal, my personality or something that I can relate to is like I want people that when they hear my name, that’s what they think of, like endless possibilities or like fun and and it’s something is.
Susan
Creating things in new ways.
Kim
It’s. Yeah, in some in something in those like simple everyday moments of just hello and having fun. My dad gave me something when I I worked in his restaurant when I was very young. I used to go there after school and he would put. A milk crate down and I would stand on it and wash dishes. And he always said be memorable and I didn’t know what that meant. I I didn’t. So what I started to do was fold the napkins for the day shift because I was there in the after school and I would leave little notes for the team that came the next day. And it was by way of being memorable. And so that all just kind of like. Felt natural to say Disney because of just that that what my dad taught me.
Susan
The connections.
Kim
When? Yeah. When I was like a kindergartener.
Susan
Ohh, I think he’s just sharing that. That’s absolutely gorgeous. And I I think it does fit you very well from our discussion today too.
Kim
Ohh that’s great, that made me happy.
Susan
So just to sum up, Kim has been so generous with her time she’s gone through all different things about brand. The brand itself is the cornerstone. You need to make sure that it’s being perceived correctly for the loyalty to be built because you want it to be consistent. If you’re ever in doubt when you’re in the building process, go out to market, talk to people. Find out who your audience is, how they’re interacting, and get that real time feedback through the market research. Trends aren’t necessarily something to always jump on. Being mindful before you do because it might not be where your audience is and it might be wasting some precious time that you could be. Devoting somewhere else? Always look for your unique selling proposition and have that etched in as part of your values and mission. Try and find those 10 words that best describe you so they’re clear and concise. And as always, visuals do make a difference. So do take time in what your colours, your fonts and everything else is, because that’s part of the brand. It represents you. And as always for me, my love of activations, they are visual storytelling, but my key call that that I learned was. Maybe you should be asking surveys at the end when people are walking through it to get a quick two minute, maybe even less little survey from them about have they heard about the brand, use the brand and what they think about it to help you gauge some more quantitative and qualitative results from those activations. Is there anything else, Kim you want to add?
Kim
No, I need you to follow me around and take notes. You did a wonderful job. I was, like, encapsulating everything I said. I’m like, ohh, I should be writing this down.
Susan
Well, the awesome thing is this is a recording. Thank you so much for your time today. Kim, you have been absolutely amazing. And I was so lucky to be able to catch up with you.
Kim
Thank you. This has been really fun. I love talking about branding.
Susan
Wonderful. We might have you back for everyone else. Don’t forget to follow More to marketing to hear some more fantastic podcasts. More to marketing.